Zinesters are not the Beats generation, we are the Beat-UP generation

[Tom Hendricks]

Zinesters are the first generation that has had it's literature completely blocked from fair reviews in the mainstream media. There were the Beats writers in the 50's. Zinesters are the Beat-up writers. No other generation has had it's best contemporary writers block so completely and so unfairly.

The consolidation of the media has ruined mainstream publishing and the media that reviews it.
For some reason the media has given up all journalistic responsibility in refusing to cover zines and almost all better indie writing.

No coverage of the revolution in any art. It is just not literature.
No coverage of the new writers in new forms.
No coverage of the new writer advocacy groups and leaders such as King Wenclas, or ULA or Musea.
No coverage on why no coverage. The mainstream media can not be questioned on their almost total generational block of fair reviews for zines.

What do you think?

[Tom Hendricks]

I am a zinester of 16 years and my audience is everyone of every age. My audience is the same as any other writers. Why would I be a snob and rule out readers that want to see what I've written?
Do readers have to pass some trendy test before they can read my work? No!!!!!

[Betty]

Tom, I think one of the things I disagree with most about your post[ings] is that you seem to overgeneralize and speak for everyone instead of just speaking for yourself. Unless "any" other writers was a typo. All. No. Any. We. Please do not automatically include me in your parade of the disenfranchised by using those words.

Further, please don't make the assumption that if people do not have the same goals as you that they are snobs ruling out readers. I mean, that's certainly one way to look at it, but a pretty narrow and defensive one, imo. Many people have target audiences for various reasons. One of the big reasons people zine is for a sense of community...i.e. finding the like-minded. Not everyone wants everyone in the whole world to read their zines. Personally, I HOPE not everyone reads my zines, for a variety of reasons. That doesn't make me a snob; just someone who knows what she wants.

Also, nobody has to pass some trendy test. Most people have some kind of access to zines...it's just up to them to get out from behind their USA Today and LOOK for it. Why does it fall on the zinester as snobbishness and not on the reader as being...oh, I don't know...lazy or disinterested? Mainstream is mainstream because it weeds out great variety for a few things everyone can jump on at once. If that's what rocks your boat, then go for it, but count me out. The mainstream is not the golden mean that I [or I assume many] shoot for. I think the world would be better off if instead the mainstream media fragmented into millions of tiny zines.

[Giz]

huh... because corporate media don't need us, and we don't need them ?

they promote an unique point of view for billions of people who blindly follow it.
a zine promote a dozen of point of view from someone who want to share it with few others, wich almost already got one).

[tim scannell]

why ever should 'mainstream' media be interested?
it is CORPORATE GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
that drowns out
'mainstream'
'zine-stream'
'free-stream'
have you not noticed that GOVERNMENT takes up
99.6% of ALL MEDIA: proposals from, regulation of,
reaction to????
grow up...pal...ripen & mature...open your eyes:
GOVERNMENT is
killing you - not
media...!
tim scannell
port angeles, wa

[kath]

I don't think zines are blocked from mainstream media, but I do think most mainstream media is not interested in zines. and I'm glad about that. most mainstream media is mostly advertising, with opinion pieces or advertorials masked as 'news'. there are few quality MSM publications imho. I like that zines have a generally smaller audience that is either other zinesters or people who have gone to the trouble to seek them out. it's the effort in searching and finding that I like. I suppose some zinesters are writing zines to help with their writing &/or art careers, but I don't think this is a universal thing. some people just like to express themselves and share with others. & be able to publish something without editorial input or having to change something if it doesn't fit in with certain policies. being able to choose your own 'rules' (or have no rules) is a good thing.

here's a recent article about (fan) zines in the guardian (via Sticky's facebook page note)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/feb/02/fanzine-simon-reynolds-...

[Tom Hendricks]

Kath, if zines are the best writing of this generation - and they are, and the newspapers cover the best writing - and they would if they were even half as good as newspapers in the past, then zines should be covered weekly in the news pages of newspapers. That they are not, or just once a year as your guardian piece shows, shows why the mainstream media is no longer fair, honest ,or good journalists. In the past the best writers were reasonably covered in the newspapers.

I think great zine writers deserve fair and honest treatment in the media. And just like any other talented artists, they deserve reasonable fair reviews of their work. Who can be against that?

If you are a reader who wants to write a diary or journal that few see and you don't want a career writing - fine. But many zinesters take their writing as something that should be honestly respected - and should build great careers for them, as great writers, musicians, painters, filmmakers have wanted through history.

[tim scannell]

zinery is not going
to
'overtake' anything...
lady 2 above right...zine is for personal
XPRESSION w/out FILTRATION
by/of/for
mainstrean rules/regs/deadlines/protocols
ETCETERA

just ply your wee avocation folks..................the
m.s. is not interested & is not goin' to review you
etcetera...................................zinery is
a personal art-form cum FORUM
tim scannell

[NicoleIntrovert]

Tom - what is stopping you from putting your zine out there to the mainstream media if that is where you want it?

Being part of the Richmond Zine Fest i have been interviewed by our Richmond newspaper about zines and the zine fest. There is interest in the media about this sort of culture. But its like you want zines to actually BE the mainstream? Then put yours there if you want it. Spend the money it takes to be part of the mainstream. Take advertisements from Budweiser or what have you or just be independently wealthy and put your own money into it.


Or why bother with zines if you just want your writing out there? Go self publish a book and get it on the shelf at Barnes & Noble if that is your goal.

[Wes White]

Dazed and Confused featured a pretty hefty amount of zines in a recent issue... the Guardian Guide features major zine events occasionally... not sure what kind of thing you're looking for, Tom? I can't think of many other examples of mainstream media that zine reviews would sit well in at all. I also don't entirely agree with those people who imply that zining isn't for people who want to have careers as writers, though, I don't see that there's so huge a distinction.

[Las Vegas Zine Library]

i think artists will create and other people will find ways to use those creations to their advantage w/out having done any creating themselves (other than creating a mode of exploitation), the artist will be exploited until they're dropped for the "next best thing". All the while there will be the illusion (for the public outside of loop)that this artist, who was singled out (by the exploiter) has more worth than the artist at home who goes unrecognized & unexploited. This creates a standard by which we judge ourselves and others that is unfair and unrealistic. Sometimes artists can use this exploitation to their advantage, sometimes not. So we can hope to be a part of the cycle(and possibly change it?), we can be thankful we aren't a part of it (makes things simpler), or we can hope to change perceptions on an micro/individual level by continuing to communicate. I think we're as beat up as we allow ourselves to be and the worth of our writing is in it's creation and not in it's recognition.by -insert other than self here- :)

[Tom Hendricks]

Zinesters - I think you are all so young you can't even imagine a time when the media was not bought off. And it was actually a reflection of the community it served.
Newspapers are supposed to cover the news and arts of the people in the community. If zinesters are in the community they should be covered. Zines should be covered DAILY - just like movies and music.
If the bulk of publishing in the us is zines - and it is, then the bulk of the NYT book reviews should be on zines - as should every other newspaper book pages.
These ideas are so far from selling out that I don't really know how to respond. But you must understand that the media we have now is not normal - it is a blip on the history timeline. Look at history. The best books got covered. A good media would search out the best writing - it would cover zinesters because that's its job. It would not cover what it does now because that is not good writing - it is hack writing - it's corporate writing. If you ran a newspaper instead of a zine and you wanted it to cover the best writing - would you boycott all zines? Yes or no?
Zines are not the bulk of book pages in newspapers and magazines that review books - until they are the system is not fair to good writers - and you should oppose it.
I see a lot of hiding in the sand here - Kinda the - hide in my bedroom and don't bother me, type behavior. You should be more active about the publishing industry - and demand more fairness for all. I've never seen a generation with its culture blocked more. And honesty one that has fought back less.
I can't imagine any musicians saying they were happy no one came to their concerts, or talked about their new albums - why are zine writers any different? If you disagree tell your musician friends that it is wrong if people come to their concerts - that's selling out.
Joe, I think you are completely wrong about King Wenclas. You are lucky there is anyone as active for fairness for writers than King. Until you do something that strong for other writers, I don't think you should insult him.

[Las Vegas Zine Library]

i will concede i am 28. my re-education regarding media/mass culture was the dead kennedys at 14. by then its already 1993 and i'm just realizing that there is life outside of radio. Yeah i cant imagine at this point a reshaping of corporate culture as i can a tear down rebuilding of culture. I do think that if people thought locally a lot could be done to change perceptions and "coverage" of all things community oriented. One problem is the perception that we CANT change ANYTHING. That we're helpless. That things arent THAT bad. I know i've felt like that. Its something i have to fight from time to time ESPECIALLY in Las Vegas. This place is ALL about corporate culture. I'm afraid that vegas is what the vision of Corp america is. a place where people feel helpless to do anything BUT go along with big money interests and opinions. where after years of trying to nurture the local community and convince people to care they just give up and move. Nothing has staying power here.